posted
Here's the way to get everyone out of trouble. Divide the proposed stimulus package up amongst us taxpaying citizens. People pay off their mortgages and credit debt and then go shopping for a new American car.
I'm a little wired on coffee, but it sounds good to me for some reason... perhaps the caffeine high.
posted
ToeTapper & LeDaemon have it correct! That is exactly the way we will fix our economy. In the meantime while everyone's bills are paid, they will start to consume and spend at our failing retail outlets keeping them in business also keeping more jobs in tact while others with paid off debts start a bunch of businesses and hire more people...you get the jest of that process. So what about these "bright minds behind obama"? LOL
quote:Originally posted by Elvzz: Oh and wait till all the small business owners that voted for this orator realize that the S-Corps will have to pay FICA on their distributions. Which essentially will cripple small biz and negate the S-Corp election. I am sick and tired of double taxation in this country and lack of employers' leadership. Who do you think creates jobs, the model or the producers?
"it's back the the lab again, yo." Eminem
Like McCain would have the fixed the economy by now.
"I don't want to get into this with you man." Bender - "Breakfast Club"
posted
The problem with LD's plan is that once the government pays off the average American's debt(s) the average American will just plunge right back into debt. That is why when you go to a bank and get a consolidation loan they cut up your credit cards and/or place a mark on your credit to basically refuse you any credit over say $3000(just an example $ amount) so you don't go back in the hole.
So LD's idea in theory sounds great and a helluva lot more beneficial then to give a bailout to a company who pays their exec's millions of dollars but claims to be broke, it would only be a temporary fix lasting a year or two if that, that is unless they placed a stipulation or a "credit cap" on the average American once their debt is paid off.
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posted
What LD mentioned has been proposed by Texas Representative Gomert. It is a capitol idea (yeah, the pun is intended).
The money goes to the people who made it to begin with. These are the folks that drive the economy as they know better how to spend their money than the tax-cheats who legislate from the alabaster halls on Capitol Hill.
As for a "temporary fix", the money will continue to circulate in the economy as long as it is left out of governmental hands. Once the money leaves the "Private Sector" and goes to the Fed, it is fixed away from those who made it and can use it.
Holy Cow, I could go on here. It is painfully clear that most people don't understand the flow of money. Then again, I shouldn't be surprised, most people who use computors don't understand the flow of electrons that power their machines.
Posts: 5067 | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
For everyone that says WW2 got us out of the Great Depression, keep in mind that the military and military spending is "Socialism". In the case of WW2, it was Socialism on steroids.
quote:Originally posted by footgirl0226: My husband listens to Rush, I dont but... all I know is Dem or Rep or Indp. I hope he doesnt fail and America gets on its feet again. Period. I hope for the best.
posted
when this presidents term/s are over the dems will believe he succeeded and the repubs will believe he failed. i think, despite what obama told us about change, that the political parties remain intact and the only thing that has changed is now the dems will receive all the criticism...despite the fact that it will take the mainstream media at least a year to come around to that conclusion.
-------------------- Always hopeful for a pretty pair of feet in my face Posts: 1955 | Registered: Oct 2008
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posted
Hadn't forgotten that McCain claimed that the fundamentals of our economy were strong; and he was correct at the time.
Our beneficent and glorious leader made the same claim recently...right after he signed legislation that virtually kicked-out the underpinnings of it.
Posts: 5067 | Registered: Apr 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Wrinklesguy: The current admin thinks that by building $10 million dog parks in California or $100,000 traffic camera systems up that it will bring the economy back, that is PURE PORK BARREL of likes no one has seen and they are lying to Americans.
I see that differently.
What if your company built "dog parks" and you employed X amount of people. Those people would be put to work and the money they make would be spent on cars, houses, LCD tvs and what not.
They said that about the "Big Dig" in Boston, but when it was at full employment, a lot of "regular" people were working and buying stuff.
Seems like an odd formula, but you have to spend money to make money.
BTW, I was laid off from a company that made parts for traffic cameras (among other optical stuff), so I hope it goes through.
posted
we had trickle down economics.. now we need trickle up economics.
with a 'bail-out' plan that rids the average joe of his debt (the middle class and below....) the person isn't strapped for cash.. and can now focus on living from paycheck to paycheck as he was already doing, but now not splitting his tiny check with a bank.
being that americans are conditioned to spend, he/she will feel free to live a little more comfortably. granted, with the credit freeze, he/she won't get back into debt. but the money that was going to debt payment will go to stuff that he can afford to pay for in cash.
with more stuff being bought by cash, the money stays in the local economy and circulates. the companys that produce will be selling and thus not laying off as aggressively. the economy will start to rebound.
and as the government continue to pour out money on 'stimuls' programs, more jobs will be created.
we may not be able to quickly get back to our credit lifestyle.. but we'll be more fiscally responsible and live within our means.. the odds of a crazy bubble happening will be less, because there is no credit to fuel those huge bubbles.
but our economy will be moving forward. later on, we'll sort out the credit deal.
right now, we need folks to feel more confident to spend instead of holding on to whatever penny they got.
as for the wealthy... they have a different mindset. this is not hurting them nearly as much as the rest of us. should they opt to "invest" in the system, it will free up credit.. especially when debts are wiped out and investments aren't laiden with toxic debt.
it's complex. too many self interest at the table.. the best economic minds are operating with the assumptions that old rules with tweaking will work.
the reality is that we've got a whole new economy in the making. one with much different rules.. one that could potentially work without credit.. i suspect that the pork-loving-lawmakers don't want this new economy to rise fast.. because it puts a lot of lobbyist and special interest groups at risk of feeling our pain!!!! they can't allow that.
but, in the next decade, the new economy will arise. the trick is to avoid being laid-off.. or better yet, finding a way to survive and make money without depending on one source of income.. until things sort themselves out.
RPM
p.s. it's my personal opinion that we could have turned this thing around this year had the media not freaked everyone out of the marketplace and the size of the stimulus package was trimmed down a bit(ok, a lot). but just a matter of opinion
posted
Allow me to propose "Rebound Economics": Money spent on one end of the economic ladder returns to the other end.
It is my guess that it must start with the wealthy (those with extra-disposable income) who invest to create/augment their own wealth. These are the ones who put other people to work creating and manufacturing items which others need or desire. The populace buys it, returning the money to various rungs up the ladder who, eventually, re-invest it to create more wealth. This reinvestment goes to those with time and talent who use it to create more procucts...And so on.
Taxes pull money away from its travel both up and down the ladder.
It's late. I hope my notion makes some sense.
An afterthought in keeping with the topic: Our beloved and beneficent Leader despises this process.
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Toetapper: That is a great explanation, in fact we need to keep the "middle wealth" holders {CEO's of midline corps like window manufacturers, building products, assembly line type companies} in business so they can employ more more people without being taxed to death. The US needs more manufacturing and productive LONG TERM job sources, not jobs for 6 months-year where once their project is done it's over like Dog Parks lol. Keynesian economics is the most bogus B.S. theory ever and it duped all these poor college students into voting a certain way and having a false hope that printing trillions of dollars will miraculously fix the economy. 1,100 page long bill and no one read it..that is Taxation without representation.
posted
agreed... more long-term job creation... the short-term jobs they're talking about is to get folks money to spend now. (but it's a tricky mule to lead)
the ladder analogy, I really love it!! great way to put it.. and taxation will hurt that ladder big time! (and the huge stimulus bill can be read as a huge tax bill)
the stimulus is needed in a way, but later it will tax the crap out of the US for nearly a decade or more!!!
if only i was super wealthy.. then.. maybe, they'd listen to my opinions.. and i'd hire folks to produce my ideas.. and help spread the wealth that way!
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